E-85 Damaging?

[SSonic]

I know with BNR's conversion kit you have the availability of running e85. Can you constantly switch between 93 and e85 and the car can automatically adjust the tune to the 2 different fuels? Also, I have heard bad things about ethanol( even the tiny 10% added to regular pump fuel) being corrosive on fuel lines and other components in the long run, especially on older vehicles designed before fuel started to contain ethanol. How will our fuel lines and other components hold up in the long run, running e85? Thank you!opcorn:

 

[sx sonic]

The LUV engine in our Sonic was originally slated to be a FlexFuel engine, although it was not released with that capability enabled.
So all the fuel line components are supposed to be compatible with E-85; It was discovered that early fuel lines to the fuel rail might not hold up to E-85, this line however was replaced under a recall and some 12 and all subsequent year Sonics received the updated fuel line.

The ECM for the 1.4t has the tables for flex fuel operation, however it is not activated. There are also terminals open to accept a fuel composition sensor. A tune is required to enable E-85, larger injectors are required to allow full power from E-85, and finally careful refueling habits and switching tunes is required when switching between gas and corn..... UNLESS you install a fuel composition sensor which allows any combination of gas and corn to be run seamlessly on 1 tune.

Check out Swordsmith's build thread for details on the fuel composition sensor and more about running corn.

Finally the only practical reason to run E-85 is increased power, fuel economy takes a nose dive compared to gas.

 

[laborsmith]

Fuel economy takes a nose dive but the price of E85 around here is lower. I calculated that the difference between cost of premium and lower mpg resulted in a wash, so it would be correct to say the major reason to go with E85 is performance.

There are two other reasons, the first being E85 burns cleaner therefore is less damaging to the climate and the second being if there is another middle east inspired oil embargo E85 may be available when other forms of gasoline are not.

I would not be surprised if compressed natural gas starts gaining popularity since here in the US we have more natural gas then we can use. Some say electric but I see the cost of electricity going up and it is about as damaging to the environment to make electricity for vehicles as it is to burn gasoline.


Laborsmith

 

[SSonic]

Ok....thanks for the helpful insight. So how have people been fueling up with e85 so far without composition sensors installed on their Sonics? Do they have to run their tanks empty before filling up with one or the other?

 

[rdss]

Run the tank down to at least 1/4 tank (lower if you're comfortable) then fill up with the new gas and flash the tune on the spot. Running E85 on a gas tune or gas on an E85 tune will only end in disappointment and a large bill.

 

[sx sonic]

For those that don't have the comp sensor switching fuel is a 2 part process.

1st run the tank as near empty as possible and refuel.

2nd before starting the car the correct tune must be flashed. Trifecta will include both files if requested, I believe It's an extra $100 for the E-85 tune and gas tune and an extra $300 for both tunes + injectors.

 

[Swordsmith]

E85's cost compared to regular gas varies wildly, here near me in PA the prices tend to be 10 cents lower than 87 octane "E10" gasoline, but down in Texas they were between 80 cents and $1.20 lower than 87. In Texas, it was still not actually cheaper per mile, but it was, as SSonic says, more or less a wash, and it's both a much more enjoyable car and a greener and more "made in Amurca" feeling one.

Trouble is, driving long distances it becomes problematic to find an E85 pump, and long distances doesn't just mean traveling, it also happens to me around home, I'll be doing one errand, end up doing another, and then a third, and suddenly realize I'm far enough away from the lone E85 pump in the area that I may not make it back.

I -could- carry a laptop and red cable with me, to flash back to gasoline tune every time that happened... but I'm much happier just being able to swap back and forth whenever.

 

[XgovernmentAgent]

I mistakenly filled up with E85, got a CEL later in the day for a P0171, running lean. Cleared the code with my SGII and it hasnt come back so far. Once I have enough room in the tank to add 1/4 tank of regular gas, I will.

I have a 2013 LTZ, Turbo.