I'm at 1200 miles on my Sonic now and, having poked around the interwebs, I'm getting the idea that it might be worth it to do an early oil change, somewhere between now and 2K, going full synthetic. I'm one of those people who like to take really good care of their toys, so I don't mind the expense if it means better performance and longevity (and I might as well have them check on how my suspension and alignment are holding up to the local potholes, and also why I'm experiencing the rough idle situation several people here wrote about). So, what do you think - good idea? and if so, please recommend your favorite synthetic oil brand that's easily available at the dealer. Unless there's one that I should buy on my own and bring with me?
First oil change: good idea to do early?
- Thread starter pounamu
- Start date
Natesriv
Lead Foot
I just went to O'Reilly and bought Mobil 1 Advanced Synthetic 5W-30. Most places have specials every weekend. I bought the big jug of it...
Online I got a package of 6 oil filter cartridgese (some name brand I can't recall)
This is the first car I've had where the oil drain plug is parallel to the ground, not at an angle on the oil pan...
Easy!
And you should change by 2000K IMHO. Breaking in an engine right helps in the long run, and that first change will have more metal particles in it...so change away!
Online I got a package of 6 oil filter cartridgese (some name brand I can't recall)
This is the first car I've had where the oil drain plug is parallel to the ground, not at an angle on the oil pan...
Easy!
And you should change by 2000K IMHO. Breaking in an engine right helps in the long run, and that first change will have more metal particles in it...so change away!
ColonelPanic
Banned
Uh oh, here we go... Might want to bring up a less volatile subject, perhaps religion or politics. 
Some people say you've waited too long if it still has the FF in it as it is backed off the truck when delivered at the dealer. Some say follow the OLM. Some are somewhere in between. Do whatever makes you sleep well at night. I tend to stretch out the interval as to not waste resources.
I did my first at 5600 miles - I would have ran it longer but based upon UOA's I've seen of the Dexos blend in these turbos I chose not to. If I had the 1.8, I would have waited longer. With a quality dexos licensed synthetic, I have no worries with running it out to the end of the OLM now.
Prepare to pay dearly for synthetic at the dealer. If they will let you bring your own, shop around. I run Pennzoil Platinum and have been able to get it for darn near free or at least around the cost of 5 qts of house brand dino after sales/rebates/coupons. Make sure they remember to deduct the cost of their oil from your billl. 9 times out of 10 when I've brought my own, various dealers would forget to take off that charge.
Some dealers will not let you use your stuff, presumably for liability reasons.
Some people say you've waited too long if it still has the FF in it as it is backed off the truck when delivered at the dealer. Some say follow the OLM. Some are somewhere in between. Do whatever makes you sleep well at night. I tend to stretch out the interval as to not waste resources.
I did my first at 5600 miles - I would have ran it longer but based upon UOA's I've seen of the Dexos blend in these turbos I chose not to. If I had the 1.8, I would have waited longer. With a quality dexos licensed synthetic, I have no worries with running it out to the end of the OLM now.
Prepare to pay dearly for synthetic at the dealer. If they will let you bring your own, shop around. I run Pennzoil Platinum and have been able to get it for darn near free or at least around the cost of 5 qts of house brand dino after sales/rebates/coupons. Make sure they remember to deduct the cost of their oil from your billl. 9 times out of 10 when I've brought my own, various dealers would forget to take off that charge.
Some dealers will not let you use your stuff, presumably for liability reasons.
ahtoxa
New member
Early oil changes in modern mass-produced cars isn't necessary. The machining is very accurate and tolerances are well-maintained. Believe it or not, modern engines need very little break and therefore, there are few metal shavings and other debris from break-in. What is there will be trapped by the filter. Following manufacturer maintenance schedule is just fine.
ChrisJ
Active member
I changed the oil on my second Sonic at around 700 miles and around 800 miles on our Cruze.
The end result was the oil was like brand new and it was a waste of time and resources.
Change it when the OLM reads around 20 or 30% remaining and use a good quality full synthetic like Mobil 1 and an OEM filter. Running Mobil 1 extended performance I change when I'm down to around 5-10% remaining. I wouldn't go quite this far on GM's oil as its known to not quite make it.
The end result was the oil was like brand new and it was a waste of time and resources.
Change it when the OLM reads around 20 or 30% remaining and use a good quality full synthetic like Mobil 1 and an OEM filter. Running Mobil 1 extended performance I change when I'm down to around 5-10% remaining. I wouldn't go quite this far on GM's oil as its known to not quite make it.
Papasonic
Active member
I subscribe to the change it early theory. Not knowing the original fill source, grade, viscosity, or quality, is one reason to start fresh early. Another reason is not knowing what manufacturing residues and assembly lubes are present in a newly built engine. Also, after viewing some members photos of their oil filters filled with metal shavings after their first oil changes, reinforces my belief that an early oil change is a good idea.
ahtoxa
New member
Well, that means that the filters are doing their jobs - collecting most of the debris.
Not sure I understand your concern with fill source, grade, viscosity and quality. It's very reasonable to think that the oil that's put into the car at the factory is ordered in large batches as specified by engineers. I cannot see any variation there. The only variation I could image is in the level of fill, which can be checked. Even then, it might be an automatically measured amount as well.
I have simply not hear of any anecdotal evidence in many years that would point to a lube issue at the factory, resulting in engine issues. I've simply not heard of that happening unless there was a physical defect.
Not sure I understand your concern with fill source, grade, viscosity and quality. It's very reasonable to think that the oil that's put into the car at the factory is ordered in large batches as specified by engineers. I cannot see any variation there. The only variation I could image is in the level of fill, which can be checked. Even then, it might be an automatically measured amount as well.
I have simply not hear of any anecdotal evidence in many years that would point to a lube issue at the factory, resulting in engine issues. I've simply not heard of that happening unless there was a physical defect.
Papasonic
Active member
I believe that the manufacturer does indeed install the appropriate lubricant when manufactured, but the fact that we don't know for sure what the original fill was, makes some individuals feel uneasy; especially running that original fill to the end of it's service interval, which could be in excess of 10,000 miles if using the oil life monitor as the gauge to determine when to change oil.
We must remember that the manufacturers are in the business of selling cars, and aren't necessarily concerned about their longevity beyond the warranty period.
ahtoxa
New member
To argue that, manufacturers are also in the business of image. I don't think that they aren't concerned with longevity past warranty period; specifically not in the case of GM. GM is doing a great job in the market now, specifically in the subcompact market, which has been abandoned by domestics for decades. I am certain that they realize that they cannot spoil this now by having reliability issues past warranty period. In fact, that is the ONLY way they can compete these days, is by implying and proving that domestic vehicles are as reliable as Asian imports. Otherwise, if this isn't the case, GM will not survive and GM understands that better than we do.
Remember that we're not talking about premium vehicles such as BMWs, where technology load out, creature comfort and driving experience surpasses long-term reliability for priority. We're talking about an appliance vehicle here, where the purchasing demographic expects near flawless reliability. In fact, those that have been driving 20-30 years ago will attest to the fact that cars are far, far more reliable now and part of that - big part of that - is the improved quality control and materials quality at the factory.
So to sum it up, I don't think we have to worry about factory oil quality. I think engineers these days know what they are doing. They have to, in order to compete and sustain current vehicle reliability track records.
Remember that we're not talking about premium vehicles such as BMWs, where technology load out, creature comfort and driving experience surpasses long-term reliability for priority. We're talking about an appliance vehicle here, where the purchasing demographic expects near flawless reliability. In fact, those that have been driving 20-30 years ago will attest to the fact that cars are far, far more reliable now and part of that - big part of that - is the improved quality control and materials quality at the factory.
So to sum it up, I don't think we have to worry about factory oil quality. I think engineers these days know what they are doing. They have to, in order to compete and sustain current vehicle reliability track records.
ChrisJ
Active member
Lets not forget that warranty period is 5 years or 100,000 miles.
That in reality is a pretty long time when you consider the amount of cars GM is selling with this warranty. If they sell 300,000 cars a year and each one has that warranty wouldn't you think even if they do everything perfect there is a pretty substantial risk of failures?
I highly doubt they would risk having to replace even 1% of those engines due to using cheaper oil than necessary or the OLM telling you to run it too long.
That in reality is a pretty long time when you consider the amount of cars GM is selling with this warranty. If they sell 300,000 cars a year and each one has that warranty wouldn't you think even if they do everything perfect there is a pretty substantial risk of failures?
I highly doubt they would risk having to replace even 1% of those engines due to using cheaper oil than necessary or the OLM telling you to run it too long.
sx sonic
New member
^^^^^^this, mostly. There's alot of factoring that goes into the end design, build cost, brand image, reliability, service intervals, owner maintanence, owner abuse, QC, etc.
The goal is to provide a car that offers competive features in It's class at a competitive cost and last ATLEAST as long as the warranty period and is as cheap as possible to manufacture.
If the goal is a 100k mi of trouble free driving then they must build the car to last for substantially more miles, like say 150k mi. Why? Short answer BELLCURVE STATISTICS, then most cars will last that long without much fanfare and the failures before warranty will be a small percentage (conversely so will the ones that last longer without issue, BC Bellaire).
That said being more vigilant about preventive maintenance than the manufacturers recommende is not a bad idea. They're using the cheapest fluids that meet the minimum requirements and recommending the longest intervals possible (because of improvements in fluids, ease of maintenance, waste reduction, and largely lazy a$$ owners). Using higher quality oil leaves you more margin of error for adequate lubrication (among many other things) while using long OCI's.
Also having worked in production machining I can safely say that contaminants are greatest during early operation as debris that has not been removed during the wash and early parts testing is dislodged and circulated thru the engine (and keep in mind the filter isn't always its 1st stop!). Also as parts are breaking in and that can add further debris and release filings that weren't removed during deburr, wash, fluid cleansing, testing, etc (they do go to great lengths to minimize this thou).
So yes doing the 1st oil change is a decent idea. It probably won't make or break the long term longevity of the engine, but it might make a difference and it certainly won't hurt it. Having worked as a tech for several years and doing production machining and washing of parts I think going 7-10k miles on the factory oil is negligent.
The goal is to provide a car that offers competive features in It's class at a competitive cost and last ATLEAST as long as the warranty period and is as cheap as possible to manufacture.
If the goal is a 100k mi of trouble free driving then they must build the car to last for substantially more miles, like say 150k mi. Why? Short answer BELLCURVE STATISTICS, then most cars will last that long without much fanfare and the failures before warranty will be a small percentage (conversely so will the ones that last longer without issue, BC Bellaire).
That said being more vigilant about preventive maintenance than the manufacturers recommende is not a bad idea. They're using the cheapest fluids that meet the minimum requirements and recommending the longest intervals possible (because of improvements in fluids, ease of maintenance, waste reduction, and largely lazy a$$ owners). Using higher quality oil leaves you more margin of error for adequate lubrication (among many other things) while using long OCI's.
Also having worked in production machining I can safely say that contaminants are greatest during early operation as debris that has not been removed during the wash and early parts testing is dislodged and circulated thru the engine (and keep in mind the filter isn't always its 1st stop!). Also as parts are breaking in and that can add further debris and release filings that weren't removed during deburr, wash, fluid cleansing, testing, etc (they do go to great lengths to minimize this thou).
So yes doing the 1st oil change is a decent idea. It probably won't make or break the long term longevity of the engine, but it might make a difference and it certainly won't hurt it. Having worked as a tech for several years and doing production machining and washing of parts I think going 7-10k miles on the factory oil is negligent.
barch88
New member
I did my first at 7000 or so, could have went longer. I follow the oil life monitor
Also, I usually change at 20% on oil life monitor, works out to be about black as can be at that point and around 6k miles with my hard driving habits. It will vary person to person and driving habits.
I use royal purple and wix filters.
Also, I usually change at 20% on oil life monitor, works out to be about black as can be at that point and around 6k miles with my hard driving habits. It will vary person to person and driving habits.
I use royal purple and wix filters.
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ChrisJ
Active member
Let's also not forget car engines did not have oil filters until I think sometime in the 1950s. Those engines still often lasted until 100K, although they were burning oil badly by that point but I think it was mainly due to the quality of the oil more than anything else.
Until sometime in the 1930s they didn't even have air filters and were usually driven on dusty dirt roads.
Until sometime in the 1930s they didn't even have air filters and were usually driven on dusty dirt roads.
ChrisJ
Active member
So, what you're saying is even if UOAs say you can run 10K and that is scientific proof that it is ok, you still won't do it for some mysterious reason.
ahtoxa
New member
Sometimes old habits are hard to overcome even knowing the facts. If changing early is simply a piece of mind, there is nothing wrong with that. Sometimes a piece of mind is worth a bit of extra money just from the mental perspective.
I am a former 3k mile OCI convert. I was religious about it but follow the manf. guidelines now.
I am a former 3k mile OCI convert. I was religious about it but follow the manf. guidelines now.
Blue hedgehog
New member
Like many have said, failures aren't good publicity under warranty or after. So why would GM set the olm too high? That being said. This is my 4th GM vehicle. I have been using Mobil 1 for 18 years and going way beyond 10k mi on my older GMs oil changes (mostly because there was no olm and 3k would happen every 6 weeks) and never had a failure. I also haven't gotten rid of any car with less than 160k miles. My '99 Tahoe I got rid of with 196k mi. My brother in law has it now with 220k+ mi. It can't hurt to do oil changes too often. I personally change the oil in any engine I've built after 1 hour of running. Those engines are built in a heavy equipment shop (bull dozers, excavators, etc) where it's almost impossible to have no dust/dirt blow into the engine during assembly. "New" engines (built at a factory) I change at 1/2 the recommended change interval for the 1st oil change. But that's just me.
Gsrdude
New member
I use UOA's more to get an idea of how the engine is wearing. Checking nothing is out of the ordinary.
I have no interest in 10k+ oil changes in any of my cars though I don't change oil at 3k either. Piece of mind, the fact I drive cars pretty hard, and all of our cars are turbocharged. I change oil more frequently then UOAs will suggest.