Foxbox
New member
How come? It wouldn't be too much more power than some of the 1.4 guys who have gone to E85 and such.
1/4 Mile Times...... Get in here!!!
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How come? It wouldn't be too much more power than some of the 1.4 guys who have gone to E85 and such.
$ub$onic
The Sticker Guy
The f17 can't handle it. There was already one member who tried it years ago and it ended with a flat bed ride.
Foxbox
New member
I'm aware.
If I recall he up'd the shot (after running a smaller one succesfully) and ruined the transmission some way.
With the proper nitrous controller and a 35 or 50 shot I think it would handle it just fine.
Foxbox
New member
Because my car doesn't need it to go 14's ??? If I owned a 1.8 I would definitely spray it.
The guy is clearly wanting to make his car a bit quicker. He's spent what seems like a fair amount of money on parts that have given him not much improvement.
$800-$1000 for a nice nitrous kit and controller seems like an easy choice to get the most gains. Most people just shy away from it due to so many saying it's not safe etc etc.
I'm just offering up other options and advice.
mitdr774
also a dinner prick
My guess is that I am a proper tune away from knocking at the door of 15s. I don't have the proper knowledge to do that on my own.
I have no desire to use nitrous oxide on my car. I don't care for it, it takes up space, has to be refilled if used, very abusive to the drive train, and I don't care for it. When I ready to build the 1.8, I will have a goal of 13s. Until then I am content with how the car is performing. I was hoping for better, but I am still happy that with a worse set up at a worse track I almost tied my previous best. Imagine if I knew what I was doing for tuning.
I have no desire to use nitrous oxide on my car. I don't care for it, it takes up space, has to be refilled if used, very abusive to the drive train, and I don't care for it. When I ready to build the 1.8, I will have a goal of 13s. Until then I am content with how the car is performing. I was hoping for better, but I am still happy that with a worse set up at a worse track I almost tied my previous best. Imagine if I knew what I was doing for tuning.
Foxbox
New member
CheapFuneral
New member
What were u racing? Looks like an old cavalier.
If I die, bury me in my truck, because it's never been in a hole it can't get out of!
If I die, bury me in my truck, because it's never been in a hole it can't get out of!
djfourmoney
New member
My guess is that I am a proper tune away from knocking at the door of 15s. I don't have the proper knowledge to do that on my own.
I have no desire to use nitrous oxide on my car. I don't care for it, it takes up space, has to be refilled if used, very abusive to the drive train, and I don't care for it. When I ready to build the 1.8, I will have a goal of 13s. Until then I am content with how the car is performing. I was hoping for better, but I am still happy that with a worse set up at a worse track I almost tied my previous best. Imagine if I knew what I was doing for tuning.
1) It is not abusive to the drivetrain
In if you mean the torque causes wheel hop, stop racing on radial tires or at least use drag radials.
It is harder on the clutch but so is having a turbocharger. The 1.8 can easily stand 50-75hp, that's old Honda LS 1.8 territory.
2) Has to be refilled? How many runs do you typically get at the track and how often do you visit the track?
If you go once a month, that's $25 to fill it. You'll get 8-12 passes out of it, with some drag radials or slicks, you would be kicking people's butts. ZEX was doing mid 13's in a dead stock (except for old header) DZ16 powered Honda Civic Hatchback.
My friends at Nitrous Express used to pick up Dodge Neon's from rental lots, install a complete system and take it to sport compact drags in the 90's and early 00's to demo the system.
He ran mid to low 14's with dead stock Automatic Neons, stock tires and everything, 75hp shot. Launch at half throttle, once the suspension settled back down, he would nail it.
Content with how the car is performing but hoping for better? Are you sure about that or did you know what you were getting into?
As friend who used race the world's fastest N/A Dodge Neon (10.01@128mph) explained once, going fast N//A is spending a ton of money to go kinda fast.
It's true, his motors were built by Sunbelt Racing engines, who are very famous in road racing circles. He got into the 12's with the knowledge he had, but to go faster he hired experienced people.
I wrote the primer on how to make a Neon go quickly and since the only difference between a Sonic and a first gen Dodge Neon DOHC car is variable valve timing and a tunable ECU which the Neon never had and if you wanted to go much faster than mid 12's you had to upgraded to a aftermarket programmable system; I know I worked with Electomotive to develop a system where they could run their TEC-III on those cars.
Firstly you aren't going to go much faster without upgrading your camshafts. Your stock cams are designed to pass smog, NVH (smooth idle quality), get decent fuel economy and vacuum for the power brake system.
Next you'll need to run really aggressive cams and jack up the static compression ratio.
Now I can tell you from experience, we had a difficult time getting cam companies to make cams for the Neon engine. Around '97 a grind designed by one of Chrysler small car/platform engineers was given to Howell Automotive. Howell then used his connections with Crane Cams to have a few billets made.
It's these cams that made everybody stand up and take notice of Neons. You could now run 14's with the SOHC and 13's with the DOHC by applying some simple bolt-ons, Mopar Performance Computer or Howell PCM (that same Chrysler connection got him more aggressively tuned computers than what Mopar Performance was selling).
With really hot cams and lots of static compression you can go fairly fast, but not as fast as the turbo cars.
Nitrous is quick and easy way to go faster as long as you respect it. Precisely because it's so cheap ($500-$600 for a kit) is why you hear so many stories of failures.
People would never try that sh*t with $3k-$4K turbo kit.
If you really want to go fast N/A your looking at minimum -
a) Hot, Hot Cams, ones that require higher compression ratios
b) Custom Header; nothing off the shelf will get the gasses out fast enough
c) Individual Throttle Bodies, the fastest N/A cars have this setup
For cams, you might want to talk to a Chevy engineer, he likely knows what it would take if he could build the ideal 1.8L engine and was limited to N/A.
Pistons you can get from JE, Diamond, Probe, etc. They'll be custom, one off, but they'll work, figure about $500 with rings.
It's not worth trying to install forged pistons on cracked metal rods, so for a set of rods, you might want to get some other 1.8 owners together and get Eagle to make some rods for you. They are made in China to reduce cost, but they are excellent budget performance rods, it takes alot of power or RPM to make them fail.
Since the ECU/PCM is programable, the money you save there are be applied elsewhere.
IMHO, be serious about N/A or don't even attempt it, you'll just be setting yourself up for disappointment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fsy1bxrnw9I
This is my boy Arthur. He holds the N/A record for Single Cam Neons. With his ITB setup he made 200hp at the wheels. With '01-'03 Neon R/T intake manifold, ported he made 197hp.
He has a really hot cam (special order grind from Crane) and 12.5:1 compression. The Dyno runs are on 100 octane unleaded.
Oh you'll need to turn alot of RPM too, think 8,000-9,000
People will give you major respect because they know you spent a lot of time (which isn't free) and money to be "different".
djfourmoney
New member
You have to be careful with those old Chrysler 2.2 Turbo cars. The majority of them aren't that fast, but a few are, especially in your neck of the woods. Lots of retired Chrysler engineers and employees even if they bought SRT-4's, Vipers, etc; many still have their butt-kicking single cam turbo Dodge/Plymouth/Chrysler cars.
djfourmoney
New member
Well, I went to Lapeer today. Its a crappy track, but it was a chance to get in a few runs to compare things.
The previous times were for the old set up that had the DDMW intake with foam filter, BNR header, high flow second cat, 2.5" magnaflow resonator, and SLP muffler (I think). A canned tune was controlling things and supposedly made 17x HP per the companies claims from logs.
Todays runs were done with some very minor HPT work on a stock tune, DDMW intake with AEM filter, stock maniverter, highflow second cat, 2.5" HP II resonator and muffler, no brand resonator and side exit. No claim on HP since I only have airflow numbers to go off of and I cant guarantee the accuracy of the theoretical power.
Pardon the last run. The trans refused to go into third without a long pause that run. Overall the car ran about a tenth slower on the "new" setup that is clearly not a power setup.
Getting a decent launch was not going to happen today, but the car was far more consistent than the last time to the track.
Sorry but for all the work done, that's pretty pathetic. Forget the ET, the MPH through the traps is TERRIBLE.
I don't know all the variables with Sonic's but with most N/A cars unless your making a ton of power N/A you'll leave the car in 3rd into the traps/lights.
If you are shifting to 4th, that's would be killing your trap speed.
At what point does the car fall on it's face? I will guess somewhere near redline since your engine is stock but for bolt-ons.
mitdr774
also a dinner prick
I dont think dropping a second off of stock times is all that bad for the minimal mods at the time. Last trip to the track was DDMW intake, high flow second cat and 2.5" exhaust, and very minimal tweaks with HPT. SO in reality, not much work done.
You can claim the giggle gas is not abusive all you want but I have talked to enough people that actually used it to have my own opinions about how abusive it is. We also know from experience on this forum that the trans in the 1.8 wont last with it.
I was hoping for better out of the car, but I am content with how it is performing now. Not sure what you dont understand about that.
This isnt some Honda that responds to minor changes. I dont know why everyone keeps trying to compare the 1.8 in the Sonic to a Honda 1.8.
You can claim the giggle gas is not abusive all you want but I have talked to enough people that actually used it to have my own opinions about how abusive it is. We also know from experience on this forum that the trans in the 1.8 wont last with it.
I was hoping for better out of the car, but I am content with how it is performing now. Not sure what you dont understand about that.
This isnt some Honda that responds to minor changes. I dont know why everyone keeps trying to compare the 1.8 in the Sonic to a Honda 1.8.
SummitWhiteRS
New member
Just installed my downpipe and midpipe from zzperformance! Holy cow! I will be knocking on 6th and 7th doors come spring time!
sonic_braaappp
New member
here's my 1/4 mile times. 2014 RS hatch 6MT, stock tune, stock tires, 155 ft above sea level and 47 degrees
