The Derploader

[Preloader]

I'm ready to go back at it guns blazing tomorrow morning. If I find that every dimension is the same in both her stock set-up and the CM set-up, then I'm just gonna space my slave out by putting a washer behind it.

I just hope the local dealer has a slave in stock. It's time to quit messing around and get the Preloader back up so I can continue my quest for more power!!

 

[GeneralZod]

Can you spec the travel?

 

[Preloader]

I cannot because the slave is in the car in the shop but.......

New development. I've been playing with my stock fly/clutch, taking measurements. +/- 0.015 is the best I can do with what I have at home.

When I started buttoning down the pressure plate I realized it takes a whole lot of torque to suck down the last 1/4" onto the flywheel!!!

This is big news because on the CM unit it closes to an 1/8" when the bolts are just finger tight, and doesn't take much to finish them down.

What this means...... Is that the step down from pressure mount face to friction face of the CM fly is likely too much. Causing waaaay too much travel of the fingers during a slave stoke.

I think I'm onto something.

 

[GeneralZod]

I cannot because the slave is in the car in the shop but.......

New development. I've been playing with my stock fly/clutch, taking measurements. +/- 0.015 is the best I can do with what I have at home.

When I started buttoning down the pressure plate I realized it takes a whole lot of torque to suck down the last 1/4" onto the flywheel!!!

This is big news because on the CM unit it closes to an 1/8" when the bolts are just finger tight, and doesn't take much to finish them down.

What this means...... Is that the step down from pressure mount face to friction face of the CM fly is likely too much. Causing waaaay too much travel of the fingers during a slave stoke.

I think I'm onto something.

Hmmm, and what about the compression of the friction material? I think that might all add up. Then you have Swordsmith with goopy clutch material. It is hard for me to figure this out with seeing, but you are really on to something.

 

[Preloader]

Good point about the compression of the stock friction plate. You're all over it!

But if I can pinch out the slop with my fingers, I can't imagine it would take so much force from a ratchet to squeeze it down, and even still, it's maybe 0.062 worth of play. I'm seeing about 0.200 difference between the stock and CM gap between the unloaded pressure plate housing and the flywheel.

That translates to a lot of pre-travel in the finger springs.

 

[Macehammer]

I'm just saying.... If I had a manual, I would thank you for all the hard work you are doing, and then compensate you heavily to do mine when I needed it.

Because I wouldn't want to be knee deep in this sh*t like you are. It would just stress me out too much.

 

[Preloader]

I'm having the time of my life. It actually is almost as fun as it is stressful....... almost.

I'm worried that my misfortune might scare others off from doing this upgrade, but once I have the definitive solution and relay it to Clutchmasters, there is no reason why anyone else should have to experience such trial and error.

And fortunately I have access to a Transmission shop. My Pops owned it for 20+ years, and the current owner used to work for him so he has been really cool about letting me use his facilities. Otherwise I don't think I could stomach this much drama.

 

[GeneralZod]

Good point about the compression of the stock friction plate. You're all over it!

But if I can pinch out the slop with my fingers, I can't imagine it would take so much force from a ratchet to squeeze it down, and even still, it's maybe 0.062 worth of play. I'm seeing about 0.200 difference between the stock and CM gap between the unloaded pressure plate housing and the flywheel.

That translates to a lot of pre-travel in the finger springs.

I have an engineering background, and I teach my student that all those 64ths or 32nds add up. If there is one place you don't want excessive slop is where you are, the trans.

Unfortunately, to get this right you need to reverse engineer. Which, is one of the most difficult areas of the design process. You have to think the way the engineer did, and why they did what they did.

With that said. I would install all the stock items and see the tolerances. Then do the same with the CM. If you are friggin tents of an inch off, it might as well be miles. they could patch work it by changing the dimensions of the slave. However, what unforeseen consequences will that have? As I stated earlier, I thought you avoided the flow chart of issues. Seems no, and I wonder about CM ability to offer newer items reliably.

Has anyone tried this overseas?

Also, the foot work you, and now Sword are doing is unacceptable. And just throwing higher end items is nothing more than patchwork.

 

[Preloader]

I agree, I really wish CM was stepping up to make me feel more comfortable about finding the solution.

However, I do know that there is no reason that it can't be done.

It's a damn good thing I don't drink. Hehehe

 

[Insanika]

Your misfortune doesn't scare me, I'm appreciative that you have the balls to go through this and blaze the trail for others. I don't have plans for this mod, but should I ever need to replace the clutch, I might look into a similar upgrade. I know others will be just as appreciative as I think this will become as important to you track boys as the tune is.

 

[GeneralZod]

I agree, I really wish CM was stepping up to make me feel more comfortable about finding the solution.

However, I do know that there is no reason that it can't be done.

It's a damn good thing I don't drink. Hehehe

Like I said, some track sponsorship that gets you race tires and rims might be in order. Maybe even throw in an extra friction plate and all is good.

Think how many people would do a tune with a light weight flywheel? The gains are relatively cheap and substantial. Intake, flash, clutch, and flywheel and you basically have a track car. Autox or strip... Take your pick, for around 3k in parts you can't bear it.

Yeah I left some other mods out. However, with those you would have a pretty mean budget Sonic. I think a tune and your trans mod have the biggest gain for the buck.

 

[Preloader]

Tune, tires and Flywheel/Clutch should be all that is needed to see 14's.

I imagine the flywheel alone can take a couple tenths off 60' times.

 

[Eric Smit]

that's the unfortunate thing about this actually. if I were to be doing this, I wouldn't have a functioning sonic because I couldn't afford the 8 days of transmission work.

 

[Preloader]

Neither could I, contrary to the belief that I'm made of money.opcorn:

 

[GeneralZod]

Unlike most of us, we don't have access to a lift. I do but I would have to yell in poor Russian if I came back the number of time Preloader did.

Also, this is most people's commuter car. This could paralyze a person in terms of life.

CM is lucky too, if someone lawyer upped they would be in trouble.

 

[Preloader]

This IS my commuter, haha. This just happens to be my first week off in 2 years.

I don't have the time or resources to go after CM, if it turns out they are at fault I just want them to make it right, nothing more.

 

[GeneralZod]

This IS my commuter, haha. This just happens to be my first week off in 2 years.

I don't have the time or resources to go after CM, if it turns out they are at fault I just want them to make it right, nothing more.

Then everyone got lucky... Thankfully.

 

[Preloader]

Found the problem!!!!!

The CM pressure disc is too thin. .125 too thin.
That translates to about 1/2" more travel in the slave.

 

[ThatTmoGuy]

Time for some Oakland engineering!

 

[Preloader]

Nah, they're gonna make it right and have me a new one here in the morning!