Auto trans shift times

[LS1notFOUND]

If the dealer does its job on the checklists, especially if you pay the premium for dealer oil change and the fancy goodwrench checklist you would think they would catch it, this seems like an easy fix to put in a TSB "poor shift performance fix".

Edit: should also say its a 140HP car...there may be some holes in the powerband down low if you dont keep your foot in it with the converter loaded up, especially if its jumping multiple gears.

 

[Bogus]

I have the answer but some people may or may not agree. I have fixed the laggy and poor shifting. Tools needed. 10mm wrench 13mm wrench or socket and i believe its a T20 torx bit. There are two causes for this problem. First and foremost your transmission is more than likely overfilled from the factory. There is a procedure to check the proper level. First the vehicle must be completely level in the air not on the ground. Two the vehicle must be running and in park. The transmssion temperature MUST be warm approx 185F to 195F not celcius. In order to achieve the it is recommend to idle your car in park for approximately 5 minutes. This is actual procedure. You can reach the fill level plug if the car is in the air. remove the u shaped splash guard if your car has one. Depends on production date. It is located on the left side of the differential housing looking towards the front of the vehicle. There are two plugs DO NOT REMOVE THE ONE ON THE BOTTOM OF THE TRANSMISSION. There is a plug 10MM facing sideways just behind the axle shaft. This is your fill level plug. Now located under the battery but reachable is the fill hole. There is a black cap made of plastic about the size of a quarter. Now that you have met criteria above while the car is running and perfectly level remove the sideways 10mm fill level plug. It looks EXACTLY like the one on the bottom. Again DO NOT REMOVE THE ONE ON THE BOTTOM. Keep a drain pan under it before you start anything. If fluid runs out as soon as you remove the drain plug and you are level and at correct temp. Your trans was overfilled. It is only supposed to drip and I mean drip not pour in any fashion. Problem number two and GM will probably never admit this. The batch of trans fluid they used is no good. You can remedy this problem without removing the drain plug on the bottom. Get a long funnel for the fill on top of the transmission and add a quart and let it run out the fill level and keeping the vehicle running at temperature. Repeat with 5 to 6 quarts. You dont just drain and fill because it will not work its way through the trans this way. I used a transmission fluid that is DEX-6 approved. This is personal experience ladies and gentlemen. I have been a Automotive technician for 10 years. Of course when done reinstall the fill level plug and filler cap on top of transmission. If you want to know what fluid I used PM me. I am not a rep for any company just somebody looking to help with frustrations. Once again I will not post publically what trans fluid i used due to laws ect ect.

you did this and it completely fixed the shifting problem?

 

[jpierro79]

you did this and it completely fixed the shifting problem?

So far my shifts are much faster smoother and crisper. 4 days "NO TCM RESET EITHER". I know this might sound crazy but car has more pep for sure. I think the friction modifiers were not up to snuff. You have to remember that when you overfill a transmission the fluid foams so to speak making it harder for the valve body to receive proper pressures to shift and ruins the viscosity of fluid. Poor friction modifiers can cause the same problem. Its a combo of both. I drove it after correcting the level it was better but not right. Then did exactly as I said in my post and with much improvement. The GM fluid gets worse as it gets hot. Sign of poor ATF stability. This can lead to premature transmission failure. I hope GM will get a tsb for this. I have a listing of TSB's for cruze and sonic I say both because same engine and transmission in both. GM does not state any fix for shifting issues. What lead me to the issue with the fluid is my girlfriend has the exact same car in white and it definitely shifted better than mine. This fix is for lagging or lazy shifts and smoothness and lack of firmness on shift. Yes shifting can be both firmer and smoother at the same time. My downshift time is also reduced. One thing though is the transmission will still sometimes feel a bit hunty so to speak. This is normal you have six gears.

 

[jpierro79]

If the dealer does its job on the checklists, especially if you pay the premium for dealer oil change and the fancy goodwrench checklist you would think they would catch it, this seems like an easy fix to put in a TSB "poor shift performance fix".

Edit: should also say its a 140HP car...there may be some holes in the powerband down low if you dont keep your foot in it with the converter loaded up, especially if its jumping multiple gears.

The dealer is not going to remove the splash gaurd and go through this whole procedure unless there is a TSB because its supposed to be a prefilled sealed system. Transmission for life as they call it. It would take them over an hour just to do this and test it in the first place. Maybe if your dealer is nice enough you can ask them to try it. You might have to back a few times to convince them but they may just put the same fluid batch back in it. Do you really think they would just dump away that kind of money in all of that transmission fluid. They would have to litteraly throw it all away. I dont think they will be doing this one unless a lot and I do mean a lot of complaints are formed. By no means am I saying your wrong I agree 100 percent. There is just that chance you might be on your own on this one.

 

[sonic1067]

Well we are now on the 4th trip for the transmission -- The car does go hard into reverse, and it a "morning" car -- it's great till it warms up that's when the problems start. My car have now left me not moving on a major highway 2 times, and stuck at an intersection crossing traffic.. But my dealership which has been doing everything they can - can not get all the problems to duplicate - GM is now involved and are putting a computer on my car so I press a button when it happens to take a snapshot ..

 

[LS1notFOUND]

The dealer is not going to remove the splash gaurd and go through this whole procedure unless there is a TSB because its supposed to be a prefilled sealed system. Transmission for life as they call it. It would take them over an hour just to do this and test it in the first place. Maybe if your dealer is nice enough you can ask them to try it. You might have to back a few times to convince them but they may just put the same fluid batch back in it. Do you really think they would just dump away that kind of money in all of that transmission fluid. They would have to litteraly throw it all away. I dont think they will be doing this one unless a lot and I do mean a lot of complaints are formed. By no means am I saying your wrong I agree 100 percent. There is just that chance you might be on your own on this one.

I was saying for them just to fix the level, all it would take is opening up the fill level drain plug right?

I have a 1.8L 5 speed for the very reason of making sure its in the gear I want it in at all times. No turbos were on the lot when I purchased or I probably would have went home with a higher payment...almost grabbed a cruze rs or eco that had a nice discount...oh well.

back on topic

My "racecar" has a built 4l60e soon to be mated with yet another high stall converter (yank pt3800) and my previous vehicles were all autos and I can never leave something alone

 

[GM_6T40_Trans_Engineer]

I have the answer but some people may or may not agree. I have fixed the laggy and poor shifting. Tools needed. 10mm wrench 13mm wrench or socket and i believe its a T20 torx bit. There are two causes for this problem. First and foremost your transmission is more than likely overfilled from the factory. There is a procedure to check the proper level. First the vehicle must be completely level in the air not on the ground. Two the vehicle must be running and in park. The transmssion temperature MUST be warm approx 185F to 195F not celcius. In order to achieve the it is recommend to idle your car in park for approximately 5 minutes. This is actual procedure. You can reach the fill level plug if the car is in the air. remove the u shaped splash guard if your car has one. Depends on production date. It is located on the left side of the differential housing looking towards the front of the vehicle. There are two plugs DO NOT REMOVE THE ONE ON THE BOTTOM OF THE TRANSMISSION. There is a plug 10MM facing sideways just behind the axle shaft. This is your fill level plug. Now located under the battery but reachable is the fill hole. There is a black cap made of plastic about the size of a quarter. Now that you have met criteria above while the car is running and perfectly level remove the sideways 10mm fill level plug. It looks EXACTLY like the one on the bottom. Again DO NOT REMOVE THE ONE ON THE BOTTOM. Keep a drain pan under it before you start anything. If fluid runs out as soon as you remove the drain plug and you are level and at correct temp. Your trans was overfilled. It is only supposed to drip and I mean drip not pour in any fashion. Problem number two and GM will probably never admit this. The batch of trans fluid they used is no good. You can remedy this problem without removing the drain plug on the bottom. Get a long funnel for the fill on top of the transmission and add a quart and let it run out the fill level and keeping the vehicle running at temperature. Repeat with 5 to 6 quarts. You dont just drain and fill because it will not work its way through the trans this way. I used a transmission fluid that is DEX-6 approved. This is personal experience ladies and gentlemen. I have been a Automotive technician for 10 years. Of course when done reinstall the fill level plug and filler cap on top of transmission. If you want to know what fluid I used PM me. I am not a rep for any company just somebody looking to help with frustrations. Once again I will not post publically what trans fluid i used due to laws ect ect.

This is NOT HIGHLY RECOMMMENDED. I can tell you with certainty, that idling the car 5 minutes will not heat it up to the right temp. You've got no proof the trans was overfilled, let alone the trans fluid is bad.

 

[sonic_bob]

this is really frustrating, for sure there is something wrong with the way this transmission shifts. I haven't gone to my dealer yet, because I wanted to see if the transmission got smarter in its learning process, but instead it seems to be getting worse. It's good news that we might have a potential fix though.

 

[sonic_bob]

This is HIGHLY not recommended. I can tell you with certainty, that idling the car 5 minutes will not heat it up to the right temp. You've got no proof the trans was overfilled, let alone the trans fluid is bad.

He seems to have proof that he fixed the transmission problem. Do you work for GM?

 

[Bogus]

This is HIGHLY not recommended. I can tell you with certainty, that idling the car 5 minutes will not heat it up to the right temp. You've got no proof the trans was overfilled, let alone the trans fluid is bad.

can you provide us with any proof why this wont work? not that i dont believe you, i just want to understand where you're coming from.

even if this wasnt the fix, changing out the factory fluids for better fluids is still better for the car... right?

 

[jpierro79]

I was saying for them just to fix the level, all it would take is opening up the fill level drain plug right?

I have a 1.8L 5 speed for the very reason of making sure its in the gear I want it in at all times. No turbos were on the lot when I purchased or I probably would have went home with a higher payment...almost grabbed a cruze rs or eco that had a nice discount...oh well.

back on topic

My "racecar" has a built 4l60e soon to be mated with yet another high stall converter (yank pt3800) and my previous vehicles were all autos and I can never leave something alone

I was going for ltz or nothing lol. They werent out yet either. The fluid level isnt the only issue though.

 

[jpierro79]

This is HIGHLY not recommended. I can tell you with certainty, that idling the car 5 minutes will not heat it up to the right temp. You've got no proof the trans was overfilled, let alone the trans fluid is bad.

Yes I have an infrared temp gun and I had it on my lift at work and I have GM fill level procedures. I am not some mope off the street. I wrote "Personal Experience." Honda had a tsb for rear differential fluid. GM has had a ton or recalls. I own a SONIC AND IT WAS OVERFILLED how do you think I found out. THE FLUID WAS DISCOLORED HINT "BAD BATCH". I SAID "if fluid runs out the fill level hole it was overfilled"""""""GM PROCEDURE"""""""". I said I am a tech and have been for 10 years. Refilled with DEX-6 fluid problem gone. So you tell me what the problem was then????

 

[jpierro79]

Well we are now on the 4th trip for the transmission -- The car does go hard into reverse, and it a "morning" car -- it's great till it warms up that's when the problems start. My car have now left me not moving on a major highway 2 times, and stuck at an intersection crossing traffic.. But my dealership which has been doing everything they can - can not get all the problems to duplicate - GM is now involved and are putting a computer on my car so I press a button when it happens to take a snapshot ..

You have other problems sorry to say.

 

[GM_6T40_Trans_Engineer]

THE FLUID WAS DISCOLORED HINT "BAD BATCH".

Do you have an analysis of the fluid properties to back up your claims? Discoloration does not mean the fluid is bad, contrary to what you think you know.

 

[GM_6T40_Trans_Engineer]

can you provide us with any proof why this wont work? not that i dont believe you, i just want to understand where you're coming from.

Let me turn the tables, where's the proof it works? So he changed his fluid. Claims it shifts better? Zero data or analysis that the fluid is actually bad. (Realize clutches will defuzz which will darken the fluid, in addition to heat cycling.) Gut feeling is it shifts better? Like I picked up 20hp with a carb spacer plate (measurement via butt dyno)? Perceptions are a funny thing. Doesn't mean I'm calling anyone less than smart. Sure he's a tech. Great. He's got knowledge of other products. Doesn't mean he's an expert with this particular product. This isn't your mom's 4 spd or grandfathers 3 spd.

even if this wasnt the fix, changing out the factory fluids for better fluids is still better for the car... right?

Where's the proof the fluid was bad?


Bigger questions is, the car is under warranty, why wouldn't you take it in? Take the service manager for a ride to demonstrate it. Specifics of the actions you're taking to induce the condition are critical. People drive differently. Different routes, grades, speeds, etc.

 

[LS1notFOUND]

That list bit is important to get a fix too, if enough make claims and document an issue thats how it gets corrected, if the dealers just keep passing it off we'll never any fixes. "If it isn't reported and written down, it didn't happen" is how the world goes with this stuff.

 

[jpierro79]

Let me turn the tables, where's the proof it works? So he changed his fluid. Claims it shifts better? Zero data or analysis that the fluid is actually bad. (Realize clutches will defuzz which will darken the fluid, in addition to heat cycling.) Gut feeling is it shifts better? Like I picked up 20hp with a carb spacer plate (measurement via butt dyno)? Perceptions are a funny thing. Doesn't mean I'm calling anyone less than smart. Sure he's a tech. Great. He's got knowledge of other products. Doesn't mean he's an expert with this particular product. This isn't your mom's 4 spd or grandfathers 3 spd.





Where's the proof the fluid was bad?


Bigger questions is, the car is under warranty, why wouldn't you take it in? Take the service manager for a ride to demonstrate it. Specifics of the actions you're taking to induce the condition are critical. People drive differently. Different routes, grades, speeds, etc.

Yes its under warranty but they did the same thing that they do to everyone else push them off. There is not supposed to be a lag between the shifts. I have 2 of these cars in my household one is mine and yes they are identical and the other one has had no such issues. I get where your coming from and if you don't have the issue with your car you won't understand. Would you rather I state that the transmission is a piece of !@## and there is no fix and we are all screwed???? Or maybe there is a simple solution. Maybe it won't solve everyone's issue. Some may have actual transmission issues. Have you never gotten a bad tank of gas before???? Everything gas, diesel, transmission fluid, motor oil, ect all start from the same base product. Crud oil. Judging by manufacturing standards of most vehicles. It would stand a better chance of a simple solution and not a complex over involved situation. I once again respect your persistance but where is your answer. I am very aware of how this vehicle is supposed to behave. I have two to compare.
Question... What do you drive????
Tell me what happens to a transmission when the fluid is too thin??????
If you feel this is not the answer then what is the answer????
I am all ears believe me. Been over a week still no lagging shifts. I once again Dex-6 approved fluid is all that went in. I didn't use some crazy ridiculous !@#$ in there. Dex-6 approved fluid. For those who don't know dexron VI or aka Dexron-6 is the approved Gm fluid in which your transmission uses.

Here is a link to a pdf of the 6t trans that comes with the sonic. Anybody notice something missing that is different about this trans HINT HINT!!!
http://www.automaticchoice.com/Catalogue/6t30.pdf

This is an exploded cut out view for those who dont know what there transmission looks like on the inside.

 

[LS1notFOUND]

it sounds like it was overfilled. you just went the extra mile and also changed the fluid. we will never know if it was the fluid bad or just the level....this seems like a pointless arguement really.

simple solution for those with shift issues, go to dealer, tell them to check the damn fluid level. if ok, theres bigger problem and get louder with them and compare with others on the lot.

 

[sonic1067]

were you able to find a fix yet ? I now have some snapshot thing on my car that I have to press when my trany does not function right but 5 trips - 23 days of my car at the dealer they can't figure it out.. GM is working with them on it but still no luck...

 

[Bogus]

were you able to find a fix yet ? I now have some snapshot thing on my car that I have to press when my trany does not function right but 5 trips - 23 days of my car at the dealer they can't figure it out.. GM is working with them on it but still no luck...

earlier he said that changing the fluid and putting it at the right level fixed the tranny issue. but thats his car. im still gonna try it & see what happens. i want to run synthetic anyways.